Fat (2019-2020) vs. Skinny (2021-current)

Scoob

Scoob

PR Founding Father
OK, any Cobra pros left on this site that has experience both the fat Cobra Sr. and the Skinny Cobra Sr.?

I mean, I need something other than "it's better". Where is it better and by how much and how?

Breaking it down,
  • the motors are about the same. Exact same base. Thinking minor gains in the intake and exhaust department that unless your kid is pinned 99.9% of the time, isn't going to be a factor.
  • the chassis obviously is biggest difference. "Handles better"....how, where, and how much? I get it, every little millisecond counts lap after lap. The easier the bike turns, flies, jumps, lands, etc. is a bonus. Not only can be faster, but can be a fatigue saver.
  • Shock seemed to have the other most significant update, but in that, what can't be made up via the proper suspension expert?
  • Other than that, mostly some weight savings and strength gains. Not trying to lessen the impact of this as well as all the combined improvements making a substantial overall gain.

Why do I ask and why do I not just go get a 2021+ yesterday? Well, I'll give you a guess, but not up for discussion and/or my question at this point. I think once I get Spencer's 2019 with a fresh top end and the suspension set up for him, he will have a viable weapon. A skinny killer? Well, depends on the rider on that skinny. I rider of the same skill set might have an advantage, but not in all cases. I've been told that the fat Cobra's are easier to grip between the legs, in the same breath, slightly harder to move around on...especially for a vertically challenge kid...lol.

Just looking for something more than I can find from the web. Virtually nothing there and even if I did find something, can I really take that to the bank? We'll get a skinny, but might not be until late summer or after the season one a couple of Spencer's peers age out in 2023.

Thanks!
 
Been wondering the same thing on these. My little guy is on the PW now and we are going to go to the SR after this season. Don’t have the money to go 50jr the 50sr etc. Just not in the cards. Per wife’s orders. But I see the “fat” ones are a heck of a lot cheaper. And to be honest at his skill level it might be easier and cheaper to get that.

Also what’s the advantage of the Cobra over the KTM Husky or GasGas?
 
Toddco327 said:
Also what’s the advantage of the Cobra over the KTM Husky or GasGas?
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The 2 above won't agree but the Cobras are for kids that can keep it pinned everywhere. They are much harder to ride, less reliable and don't hold their value compared the the Austrian brands.

Made it through all the 50 years with only 1 issue on ktm, had a gasket sealing issue I figured out and not a single issue after. All my other friends were swearing by cobras while repairing them weekly. It's the dirty little secret nobody will tell you because they are all in and its hard to admit. If I were wrong, Cobras would hold their resale value like the others do.

Most all the fast kids are on Cobra but it's because Cobra hands out elite rides like water. And the top kids can ride them as they are designed, pinned. If your kid isn't a top 5 lorettas kid, the Austrian brands will suit him better. The clutch adjustability and smoother power band make all the difference in the world.
 
hershey said:
The 2 above won't agree but the Cobras are for kids that can keep it pinned everywhere. They are much harder to ride, less reliable and don't hold their value compared the the Austrian brands.

Made it through all the 50 years with only 1 issue on ktm, had a gasket sealing issue I figured out and not a single issue after. All my other friends were swearing by cobras while repairing them weekly. It's the dirty little secret nobody will tell you because they are all in and its hard to admit. If I were wrong, Cobras would hold their resale value like the others do.

Most all the fast kids are on Cobra but it's because Cobra hands out elite rides like water. And the top kids can ride them as they are designed, pinned. If your kid isn't a top 5 lorettas kid, the Austrian brands will suit him better. The clutch adjustability and smoother power band make all the difference in the world.
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Works for me. We aren’t going to Loretta’s. Or really even racing. Just going to the track from time to time and having fun. Looks like Cobra is out KTM is in.
 
Toddco327 said:
Works for me. We aren’t going to Loretta’s. Or really even racing. Just going to the track from time to time and having fun. Looks like Cobra is out KTM is in.
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I would do more research. I have had little trouble with my 2019 Cobra. Best I can see at this point the fat may be harder to touch for the shorter rider. Spencer is shorter, but when you are riding, you do not need to touch, right?

Aside of that, the engine is strong. Thinking is KTM Jr. was in the area when we got rid of it. I had it running good. Austrian brand engine designs are 23 years old. Still a good engine, but will not run as good everywhere as a good running Cobra.

Oh, and Spencer doesn't ride "pinned". I wish he did. We are getting there, but not 100% certain we ever will. Not certain we are going to Loretta's either. Might try, but he's not fast enough to get past the Regional if we could get past the Area at this point. His best holeshots, jumps, and confidence have come on the Cobra though. May not be a fair comparison given the let downs we had on the KTM, some not the fault of the KTM to be honest, but is what it is. I was looking at a 2021 Cobra King and Spencer didn't want to give up his 2019 if that tells you anything. He likes it.

The only other thing that would sway me to the Austrian brands would be the availability of parts online. I shopped almost exclusively with Rocky Mountain when we had the KTM. Not so much now excepts tires, chain, and carbs parts (excluding slide). Rob Minton has everything though and will ship out same day with what you need.

That all said, I am happy with the our 2019 Cobra. If you go that route, get a 2017 or newer. That is the latest engine design and I haven't heard of nor experienced issues....yet, like I did with the KTM. Granted, the KTM was a 2009 (first year of current engine design) and hindsight my troubles were all carb related. If I would have only new that $2000 earlier...lol.

Get what makes you happy bro. When you are ready, give me a shout, I may be ready to unload our 2019 for a 2023 50 or 65 as I am really thinking about going that route.
 
Another note(s). I should have wrote a book. Not that anyone would have read it, but that they might have and at least been informed more than I was and enjoy these 50 days more so... ;)

I'm always tinkering, trying to get more out of something. Some of this was my demise in the past two years, but a benefit in what I learned. Failure is the best teacher most times...

As mentioned prior, the Austrian clutches are adjustable and can be a benefit to lessen the "chick-wing" throttle as I call it. As mentioned also, the Austrian brands current motor was created in 2009. Only difference for the most part was an updated clutch in 2012 I think it was that made adjustment easier, but was still flawed. IRP comes to the rescue there, but you loose your adjustablity, so maybe just change your oil often and wait on that until your kid is ready to get more hit down low. The IRP clutch does east this hit providing more of a clutched engagement than just a "snap" type engagement. They offer an IRP clutch for Cobra's as well.

Some other considerations between the two are how long do you plan to keep the bike. My feeling is if you kid improves to an extent, he (or you) will be left wanting more on an Austrian 50. I have had a couple friends in our class, including me, start on the KTM, etc. and not are on a Cobra Sr. Heck, one friend had a Husky Sr. and is now on a Cobra. Not because of problems with the Husky, but performance. Kid is not a LL top 5, probably more in Spencer's space with more experience and race craft, that got tired of getting beat by Cobras. First weekend on the Cobra, pulls a holeshot. Didn't win, but gave himself the best opportunity to do so though... Granted, knowing what I know, the Husky may not have been the best it could have been, but started and ran well.

I pray the best of luck and good ridings to anyone in the 50 ranks. They are challenging. Not so much the bike stuff, but the kid learning, the coach learning to speak the kid's language (and understand it in that "good" doesn't always mean good...lol), etc. You always want the best for your kid and will do almost anything to make it happen. When the bike fails, it just sucks and the kid doesn't understand that part of life yet. We are in a good space right now, finally, Cobra or not I suppose, and just hope we can continue that into 65's and beyond.

Good luck everyone! :)
 
Still really haven't answered my initial question.... ;) Well, other than I guess maybe I should look at a 2023 Cobra CX-50 Sr....lol. I know they have added an additional brace between the frame and engine in the 2022 FWE and all 2023 Sr's....
 
4DAIVI PAI2K5 said:
Yes, get a 23 cobra Sr 50, I would do a king instead of a fwe but that's just me.
Minton will take care of you.
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Yeah, from conversations, the King may be the way to go. In time. Gotta run the snot out of this 2019 King first...lol. Laters.
 
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