AHRMA rd 8, "OHIO"

Sorry you were disappointed , NQ , but I was afraid that might happen . What you have described is pretty much the essence of a grass track - no gate ( a ditch or log to stay behind and a rubberband or flag start usually ) , shorter start straight ( just imagine 40 bikes tapped out in 4rth going into a flat or offcamber , wet , grassy turn = carnage ) , stakes and ribbon marking the boundaries of umpteen turns in fields , no jumps ( hopefully they at least utilized the elevation changes to give a chance at getting the wheels off the ground ) .

The beauty of a grass track is that while the sod is still intact , you can go almost anywhere ( too much moisture and that story changes ) . You can really have a blast dicing with guys when it is like that . As the day wears on , as KO stated , a motocross track is born as main lines , berms , ruts , accel/decal bumps , etc. form . Developing your own racing lines to outmaneuver the competition is key . The track is constantly changing .

I'm waiting to hear from some buddies who went ( most just to spectate due to injuries ) for their opinions . They are even more ancient than me and have raced many a grass track layout . Most have been racing for 40+ years and have never owned a " modern " bike , one not even a PV machine .

I realize that you are newer to the vintage game and are coming at from the opposite direction than us old bast.... uh , guys . You really didn't have anything to compare it to , having never ridden a true grass track before . Did you walk the whole track ? May have been a bit more to it than visible from the pits . After all your time , money , and effort invested I kind of wish you would have given it a shot anyway . Might have ended up liking it but it isn't for everybody for sure . Vintage racing , to me , has always been about competing against all the riders on the other cool old bikes and not so much conquering a track . I've always said the track is the same for everyone on it ( tell this to young racers on modern tracks too , who say there is too much/not enough of this or that ) . Many vintage tracks I raced were not really a challenge but I still had a blast racing with somebody of similar skill ( read that as " lack thereof " ) no matter what position it was for .
 
I actually did walk most of the track, except for the very top flat section that went out and wrapped around the ski lift. I studied it hard for over half an hour. Packing up and leaving a track is not something I would normally do. Out of character really. Remember... I was one of very few that raced the flooded mudfest at Mid-Ohio last year, when so many others packed it in.

No gate flag start, is Ok, been there done that.
4th gear to first turn, eh...wasn't likely on this track and definitely looked like you would be in 2nd gear trying to roost your way through the maze of switchback hairpin turns as you ascended the hill.

There was one little swayle at the top of the hill headed west, that you dipped into, but wouldn't offer any significant air coming out. Just a natural terrain dip obstacle immediately followed by another turn.

I was excited and anticipated a good time coming into this race. I was totally cool with it being all weeds (recently brush hogged), but I just felt that they could of done so much better on the course layout.

I was visualizing a long fast start with a sweeping turn going to an uphill or down hill, some good straight aways sections (flat and , up and down hills), interrupted by turns that were more naturally coordinated and following the layout of the treelines and land elevation dynamics. Maybe some drop offs or smaller hilled jumps, maybe a ski jump or fall away downhill.

What I saw more than anything was my bike getting seriously overheated and worn out for nothing.

Kind of a side note: Over the years Nancy has developed a pretty good eye for tracks, always viewing it in regards to taking pictures and video of the race. She struggled to see much appeal at all in this layout. She thought it was a very cheesey and offered very little.

I'm anxious to hear from Jeff Vlk, he and his son stayed and raced.
 
NQ1965 said:
I actually did walk most of the track, except for the very top flat section that went out and wrapped around the ski lift. I studied it hard for over half an hour. Packing up and leaving a track is not something I would normally do. Out of character really. Remember... I was one of very few that raced the flooded mudfest at Mid-Ohio last year, when so many others packed it in.

No gate flag start, is Ok, been there done that.
4th gear to first turn, eh...wasn't likely on this track and definitely looked like you would be in 2nd gear trying to roost your way through the maze of switchback hairpin turns as you ascended the hill.

There was one little swayle at the top of the hill headed west, that you dipped into, but wouldn't offer any significant air coming out. Just a natural terrain dip obstacle immediately followed by another turn.

I was excited and anticipated a good time coming into this race. I was totally cool with it being all weeds (recently brush hogged), but I just felt that they could of done so much better on the course layout.

I was visualizing a long fast start with a sweeping turn going to an uphill or down hill, some good straight aways sections (flat and , up and down hills), interrupted by turns that were more naturally coordinated and following the layout of the treelines and land elevation dynamics. Maybe some drop offs or smaller hilled jumps, maybe a ski jump or fall away downhill.

What I saw more than anything was my bike getting seriously overheated and worn out for nothing.

Kind of a side note: Over the years Nancy has developed a pretty good eye for tracks, always viewing it in regards to taking pictures and video of the race. She struggled to see much appeal at all in this layout. She thought it was a very cheesey and offered very little.

I'm anxious to hear from Jeff Vlk, he and his son stayed and raced.
Click to expand...
 
I went to this one with the same reservations for sure. I actually loaded up my PV bike, a pit bike(72 Suzuki TC125 with hi/low), all gear, gas, etc. you would normally bring to a race. I wasn't racing Saturday but I figured I would head up with tent my tent and sleeping bag in hand and see where it went with option of heading home(1h20m) or staying the night. When I arrived and saw the track was a bit away from the parking lot I unloaded the TC and buzzed up to the lodge and asked if it was okay to ride up by the track and the said "no problem" Worked great for me as I could jam it in low and go straight up the hill saving my ailing knee the pain. I watched the whole day up the hill with a great view for racing I bumped in to Steve I met at Log Road last year and we spent the day on the hill watching the racing - good track - not really, good racing - always. The weather was beyond good as well. At the end of the day I was still on the fence on staying the night or heading home and coming back. I again bumped into Steve who was talking with Tim who I just met Memorial Day weekend at Rt 62 -they new each other. I said are you guys both hanging out? They were so I decided to stay. Had a great low key time, a few cold ones, a good night of sleep, and I got to know 2 other vintage devotees better in the meantime. As always there was nothing but good people at this event. I woke up looking at the steam rising off my CR and the sound soon came of the 2 stroke lighting up like it always does- I will never get tired of that. I was also told the cross country course was pretty good?

I knew the MX track wasn't great and only signed up for 1 class(40+ int). I also needed to see how my knee liked racing and by the way I rode I think my psychological fear likes it less than my knee. Like NQ says there were few places to get moving into even 3rd(rare), no jumps, a real short start, and quite a bit of "why did they do that" sections. If nothing else it was safe with a few moments of pleasure. I also think the reason the track was smaller is because they did not want it to be worn in and be visible from the parking lot. They probably didn't want to deter potential ski customers for a one day race so they kept it out of sight. I have never bought a seasons pass without seeing an area in the summer as they all have fund raisers/open houses in or before October. That industry also tends to be very pro environment. I know- they cut down trees and install chairlifts all over the place.

I rode like crap but I finished and stayed upright. I paid $60 to race, $20 to get in, $35 gas(car and race), and probably $30 on food/drinks. For that I got a 30 minute practice(only did 6 laps), 2 - 5 lap motos, 30 hours of hanging out with vintage guys, buzzing around on my beloved TC, and watching racing in perhaps the best weather this state ever sees. As an added bonus mxkid had some really good battles with Oscar G and held him off while what appeared to be his whole family watched.

I was home having a steak dinner with my wife and kids by 7:00, everything unloaded and put away. Would I pay the same money and time for the same experience again? Me I would. If we don't support either of these series when they come to our neighborhood we might not have any to support before we know it .

NQ - you are not wrong by any means as I am guessing you were thinking about CC and 2 PV classes - that my friend is a day about racing. I am a bit more on the side of the experience and less on racing. I do however hope they do it again next year with a better track!
 
Great info Bill, and I do regret missing the part of hanging out with all of you guys. That is really where it's at. My loss!
But I was intending on 2 class's for Saturday Vintage, and if all went well ,Sunday Cross country on my KDX and 2 class's MX on my Yamaha.

And Wheeler (mxkid) sets more of an example that I should be following as Mike lives very local to me, is a tremendously committed die hard MX racer and I actually look up him. I think Mike keeps everything in perspective more so than I.


If I can side track for a moment, it's amazing the value that comes from just casual gab about this stuff.
I owned a dual range/8 speed TC125 as well. The bike was my first real motorcycle. I worked my way from a moped type bike at 12 yrs old, to two Honda mini trails that wouldn't run, which I traded for the Suzuki, which was a basket case. But I was excited because it was a real bike. I worked on it for 4 or 5 months, and then told my mom on my 13th B-day that September, that all that I wanted for my Bday was to get that bike running. My dad spent a week with me making that happen. I rode the bike every day. I regularly siphoned gas out of the old mans truck just to ride. ( looking back I'm sure he knew I was doing it, hee hee ). Oil injection pump failed, It seized up on me twice, rebored twice, split the cases and had the mains cross drilled for oil flow, etc etc. From mowing lawns, shoveling snow and odd jobbing I had over $400 hard earned dollars into parts and repairs. But I learned tons, and became hooked for life.

Similar to this one, minus all the metal, and made to resemble a MX bike
1974 Suzuki TC125.jpg
 
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Actually mine was a TS125 , had a vice grip shifter and I'm not kidding. I moved up from a Solex moped! I saw this TC on CL for $125, topend off, and dove head first into my first restore about 7 years ago. I of course started figuring out pretty quick the headlight, kickstarter, anything chrome pretty much don't exist anymore. I spent so much getting it to where it is I was absolutely bent on getting a title. I have one but that was an ordeal in itself - trust me. I have had it at a few events and I get asked every time if I will sell it. I don't even ask how much they'd pay - I don't think I'd sell it for any amount near what it's actually worth because I actually take pride in it. Also - you pretty much can ride it around the swap meet at Mid-Ohio in 1st low without your hand on the throttle if you want. If you see me you at Mid-Ohio by all means take it around for a bit for old times sake!

TC125.JPG

TC1252.JPG
 
Bill that thing looks great! Nice job!

Funny you guys brought that up. I had a TC185 dual range bike a few years ago. I actually sold it to Babet, he used it for a bit and sold it.
 

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Man you guys have the patience of Job to do restores like that.
Thats a beauty.

My bike finally bit the dust for good and I sold it.

At my first visit to Vintage Days I came across one that was in really good shape and for sale. The owner let me sit on it. The trek down memory lane from 30+ years ago was kind of surreal for a few minutes. The thought occured to me that I even had the cash in my pocket to buy it. Then I recalled wasting all my available cash on that money pit and it felt like the curse from my childhood so I bid my goodbye and walked away .:D

I'm trying to remember that AMA guy, name James ?, A couple years back he actually rode a TC125 in our local annual enduro ride at Flint Ridge Park, and wrote an article about it. If I remember the story correct, he ran out of gas mid way through the event. His was a nice bike as well.

Mike do you miss the 185? That had to be a fun little bike.
 
I do. I actually just picked up an xl 250 to ride at mid-ohio this year. Probably sell it when I'm done there
 
Just personal opinion. Grasstracks like the one you describe are my favorite. Line selections everywhere,
no stupid man made jumps on a perfectly good motocross track, and a good workout flicking the bike around.
Throw in a couple of long straights with first gear turns at the end and they are perfect. For vintage MX,
these are the best.

For PV, I don't know, never got into those things. In the day I had a couple but then I figured out that I could make money
roadracing but not motocrossing. All that suspension is wasted on me, and on a grass track.
 
No money to be made but you missed some good vet class motocross back in the 80's.

Grass tracks are my favorite also. That's what I ride at home, complete with grass jumps. Everyone had a good time riding the grass track at Mosher's farm from the pros to common folk like myself.
 
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