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1982-1985 KX125/250/500 in AHRMA Ultima Class

Discussion in 'Old Guys & Old Bikes' started by Dano762, Nov 8, 2015.

  1. Dano762

    Dano762 PR Member

    Location:
    Hebron Kentucky
    Racing Number:
    762
    There was a 2016 rules change proposal to allow KXs with front disk brakes but not power valves in AHRMA Ultima classes.

    The proposal did not pass. VETRIDER801 just posted that his favorite bike was a 1985 KX125. It would have been interesting if the rules change had been approved.

    SECTION 12 – POST VINTAGE MOTOCROSS
    12.3.2-4 – Ultima Classes and Eligibility Allow certain 1982-’85 Kawasaki KX125/250/500s in their respective displacement classes, if they were produced with OEM front disc brakes, rear drum brakes, Uni-Trak rocker-linkage rear suspension and liquid-cooling. “KIPS” power-valves are not allowed. (Jason Colon)

    Committee: Yes
    July Discussion: FM motion to accept; RP seconded July Board: ( 4 For (FG, FM, RP, BR)/ 8 Against the motion)

    October Discussion: RP motion to reject; KS seconded October Board: ( 11 For/ 1 Recuse (FG) the motion)


    I am not sure what "Committee: Yes: means?
     
  2. racer726

    racer726 PR Member

    Location:
    Michigan
    I think they have a rules committee that offers a recommendation for the board. It only got 4 yes votes in July. Then got even less in October. Bummer deal. I would like to see the 1984 CR 250 and 500's eligible for Ultima.
     
  3. Mike

    Mike PR Addict

    Racing Number:
    29
    Committee = dinosaurs
    So its very confusing, the ARHMA board is made up of a bunch of Nixon era old farts, they are still hoping (optimistically) one day that there will be color TV........ completely fuc***ing clueless.

    It is set up that the committee which is made up of much more reasonable people make a recommendation, In this case they recommended that a 1982 MX bike is in fact a 1982 MX bike, and as such it is a PV bike.

    Secondly the board ie: the dinosaurs said there is no way a 1982 bike is a 1982 bike, and then once again last month they confirmed that a 1982 bike is not a post vintage bike.

    Stupid would be a polite way to describe these "leaders". In no MX Action or Dirt Bike magazine review was the Kawasaki even in the top 2 bikes.

    It is an example of the exclusive, not inclusive nature or AHRMA, and the reason the membership is now close to 3,000 from the ,more than 5,000 is was just a few years ago.

    Although they allow these bike to compete "unofficially" there was an 1983 KX125 c/w disk brake beside me on the line at Unadilla, approved specifically by Fred Guidi.


    We love new bike, new 1964 BSA's we love 1961 Indians, we even love those damn new 1967 Husky's

    Unfortunately the average age of the committee is approaching 100, they spend the meetings talking about the best deals on depends and compaing about social
     
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  4. Vet261

    Vet261 PR Addict

    Location:
    Valley City, Ohio
  5. Vet261

    Vet261 PR Addict

    Location:
    Valley City, Ohio
    In my opinion, all they need to do is separate the "main" eras of classes. In 1984 I had to race my RM against KX's and CR's with front disc brakes.....but now it isn't fair? That's silly.

    The other thing about this is --- my re-lined, arc'd front drum brake on my 1984 RM250 probably works 10 times better than those KX disc brakes....
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2015
    dmx153 and KRH like this.
  6. racer726

    racer726 PR Member

    Location:
    Michigan
    Fred really does try. Too bad he's with AHRMA and not the AMA. He's trying to move AHRMA forward but the board just keeps pulling things back in. It's like they are scared that everyone is going to forget about the dinosaur bikes. What they fail to realize is that the organization will keep shrinking unless they change with the times. I love riding vintage bikes, but until AHRMA expands to newer bikes I'll only do a one day membership for Unadilla.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2015
    KRH, dmx153 and Vet261 like this.
  7. KRH

    KRH PR Member

    Racer726, are you the one who has been arguing with yessong on Mark's Vintage page?
     
  8. racer726

    racer726 PR Member

    Location:
    Michigan
    Ha ha, yep that's me. Arguing with him is like trying to win a pissing match with a skunk. It's pretty amusing though. I'm guessing he's old.
     
  9. KRH

    KRH PR Member

    Man, I just don't understand his (or AHRMA's) thinking. It just doesn't make any sense to me. He'd rather watch it shrink and die than evolve and survive. Dumb

    KRH
     
  10. racer726

    racer726 PR Member

    Location:
    Michigan
    Most of those die hard classic class AHRMA guys just want a rolling hills track with no jumps or modern bikes. Even a 1990 is modern to them. Go figure? They do have some killer vintage only races in the NW though. That's about it as far as vintage only. The rest of the US doesn't have a following like they do.
     
  11. MotoJason

    MotoJason PR Member

    Location:
    Grand Rapids
    Racing Number:
    5J
    Thanks Mike for putting this issue in the spot light. As you know, I am the guy who wrote the Ultima class rules change to allow the disk brake KXs to compete in their respective Ultima classes. As you stated, the premise of the proposal was that the brake technology on the KX's was not a significant advantage over any of the other bikes of the time. Back in the day those bikes were competing with each other in 82-84. Excluding KXs rewrites the history AHRMAs mission attempts to preserve. The precedent already exists in AHRMA rules, there are exceptions and exclusions that, to me, seem arbitrary. Some early PV bikes can run OEM disk brakes (Yankee / Rokon), and Yamaha YZs in Ultima can have exhaust power valves, but no other brands can.


    For me, a big draw to vintage racing is reliving the memories I had of riding the bikes I rode as a kid/teen. Those bikes were KXs. So, that is the brand I want to race now.


    In general, I think the AHRMA rules are confusing and there are too many classes. I think the class rules should be more inclusive, that would help the goal of getting more bikes and riders to the races. I'd rather race 20+ bikes that are similar enough, than 1-2 that are almost identical.


    We can start an entire thread on track design for vintage / post vintage as it seems to be a hot topic of debate. I have raced my 75 KX125 and my 83 Husky CR250 at several tracks this year that host modern and vintage races. A good, safe track is fun to ride regardless. Lake Sugar Tree, Sick Bros MX, and Tomahawk were great on both bikes. I think Rio Bravo and Unadilla would have been very good on the 75 too. McKees was a true grass track and I didn't care for riding it on either bike really, Speed City in MD was an SX syle track with steep jump faces, big step ups, and a fairly technical rhythm section. The jumps were challenging (painful actually, but the throttle turns both ways and that's on me), the big berms were awesome though.


    In my opinion, we can stay home and bitch about what is wrong with the rules, the tracks, the promoters, etc. Or we can show up and actually race regardless of circumstances that may not be ideal or to our liking. I want vintage/post vintage racing to be successful because I love 80's MX bikes and riding them. I believe change happens from the inside, so I show up to race and I voice my opinion.


    If you are an AHRMA member VOTE for new trustees this month that represent your interests! Come January I will submit my Ultima KX rule proposal again for 2017. If you have a KX or are an Ultima competitor voice your opinion too. We can't let the old guard take away our fun!
     
  12. Dano762

    Dano762 PR Member

    Location:
    Hebron Kentucky
    Racing Number:
    762

    I will certainly voice my opinion, we met at Moberly and I have the '79 KX.

    I was hoping for the change because there was really nice, low hour 84 KX250 on Ebay a few weeks ago.

    My wife likes that fact I ride a green bike because I am so easy to find on the track amongst a sea of yellow.
     
    MotoJason likes this.
  13. NQ1965

    NQ1965 PR Elite

    Location:
    Heath, Ohio
    Reading my most recent Vintage Views magazine, I was quite surprised that the current National Off-road Director for AHRMA, Fred Guidi, is from Grafton, West Virginia.
    How come he's not a Pitracer member???????

    He's currently running for re-election to his AHRMA office as well. And his two contestants are both Ohioans.
     
  14. Mike

    Mike PR Addict

    Racing Number:
    29
    He and the national director are both "LURKERS" based on comments they have made, source = PITRACER
     
  15. evomx244

    evomx244 PR Addict

    Racing Number:
    Original 241
    Fred's just the latest in a long line of people that have tried to bring AHRMA out of the dark ages. Most just give up and flip AHRMA the bird and start their own series (Rick Doughty American Retorocoss, Dave Boydsen
    American Vintage Dirt Racers (AVDRA), Woody Graves Mid-West Vintage series, Rich Fogel American Classic Racing (ACR) Ect . . . . everyone one of these series was started because they got tried of fighting AHRMA and narrow minded way of thinking.
    Each of these clubs/series created a simpler less complicated race program. Seriously we're arguing over bikes that raced in 82-84 for the PV Ultima class? which is designed to be bikes from those years. and they wonder why membership is shrinking ? PS I love old DIRT bikes :)
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2015
  16. racer726

    racer726 PR Member

    Location:
    Michigan
    We only have 4 classes in the local Michigan vintage series. We race the same day as modern bikes most times. 4 classes, strictly by year. Go out and have fun. Pretty simple formula.

    It looks liked Twisted MX in Milan, MI is going to host a round of the series this year. We need to get some of you guys from Ohio to come up and race with us!
     
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