TimSr90
PR Addict
Fees are not limiting growth. Stick and ball sports being cheaper are a factor.
I can't reconcile these two factors.
Growing our Sport ?
- Thread starter hershey
- Start date
Fees are not limiting growth. Stick and ball sports being cheaper are a factor.
I can't reconcile these two factors.
hershey
PR Elite
You have a good pee wee track....wtf?
You see its a mentality like this that kills the sport, the pw's are the entry level bike. Yes a strider with wheels but look at what bike all of todays top riders started on....a pw. So yeah, lets get rid of them.
Like I said earlier, building a good track and being a good business man arent the same. Cater to the entry level and grow the sport. Dont choke off your future revenue. Cigarette companies did it right, remember those cheap candy cigs we had as kids? That stunt helped fuel the worst habit in America today, people still do it even though it kills you.
So how about any other track owners???? Nobody else running a track has any input?
hershey
PR Elite
Haha....to addicted to it myself to quit ... ever! Well until my body gives out.
BriarcliffMx
PR Founding Father
I talk to a number of people, while I cant possibly talk to everyone, but I do hear from people that left the sport or friends of mini parents that are thinking about entering the sport, that cost is a major factor, and that baseball, football and basketball are cheaper. So at least from the audience that I listen to, I hear both. My personal opinion is that traditional sports have been given a major push by the parents in my generation, its become a major ordeal.
psycobikerbob
Noob
Just my opinion I don't own a track and both my sons have progressed to bigger bikes and tracks however they did start on pee wee bikes and at the time I lived in cleveland and going to the different tracks was the only option for me. I say if you are unhappy with the price of the tracks then save your money buy a parcel of land get some equipment spend the hours necessary to build a pee wee track and let them ride there in the end it will only cost around 25000 or so and I'm sure it will be well worth it. I mean you would be saving like 50 bucks a week for the year or two your kids will be riding on it and then they will progress to a bigger bike and track and no longer need the pee wee track. It's the price of riding we should be thankful we have places to go and if it's too expensive now you better find a different sport cause it only gets worse. Again this is just my opinion have a great day everyone and ride safe.
BriarcliffMx
PR Founding Father
One thing to consider here. This entire thought process about 50s is geared around the idea that racers start on 50s. I would be willing to bet that a large majority do not start on 50s and make it to big bikes and stick with it. Why cater to one bike size to create growth? Kids, young adults, and vets can start at any age. To say that tracks and fees are limiting the future growth is short sighted. Look at the big picture, we should be marketing anyone that would enjoy and respect the sport, as well as someone who can financially pull it off.
hershey
PR Elite
See ... the last 2 posts have me banging my head against the wall. Did brains just leave the building???????
let me make it clear for all of you....
ITS NOT ABOUT THE $@$@$@!!!%! MONEY !!!!
I hope that clears it up.
Its about what you provide for that money. And Im sure not all racers start on PW bikes. But there is a large group that do. If you dont want to cater to them I believe you are shooting yourself in the foot.
I dont know why this has turned into a BC thread, maybe because JO is the ONLY track owner to chime in. But of the 4 tracks I went to this year it was the best one and my boys favorite. Havent been to RT62 yet but I hear he does a great job for the little guys. If his winter indoor series is any indication then it should be great. He pulls 150 kids on 85' s and under for that tiny little indoor track. He has a business model for growing our sport that all tracks should follow. His winter indoor series draws just as many if not more riders than most outdoor tracks in the summer draw total big and little bikes. In that venue he provides a fantastic racing experience for those riders and parents are HAPPY to spend the money.
So why would you not want to do the same as that? Would not a good outdoor track be worth that type of turnout for minis? Would catering to this crowd be unprofitable? Would those riders not become big bike riders spending more money?
Limiting thoughts only limit results.
let me make it clear for all of you....
ITS NOT ABOUT THE $@$@$@!!!%! MONEY !!!!
I hope that clears it up.
Its about what you provide for that money. And Im sure not all racers start on PW bikes. But there is a large group that do. If you dont want to cater to them I believe you are shooting yourself in the foot.
I dont know why this has turned into a BC thread, maybe because JO is the ONLY track owner to chime in. But of the 4 tracks I went to this year it was the best one and my boys favorite. Havent been to RT62 yet but I hear he does a great job for the little guys. If his winter indoor series is any indication then it should be great. He pulls 150 kids on 85' s and under for that tiny little indoor track. He has a business model for growing our sport that all tracks should follow. His winter indoor series draws just as many if not more riders than most outdoor tracks in the summer draw total big and little bikes. In that venue he provides a fantastic racing experience for those riders and parents are HAPPY to spend the money.
So why would you not want to do the same as that? Would not a good outdoor track be worth that type of turnout for minis? Would catering to this crowd be unprofitable? Would those riders not become big bike riders spending more money?
Limiting thoughts only limit results.
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psycobikerbob
Noob
Wow nice language and it is about the money you are not complaining about the weather it seems to me you are upset about what you are receiving for the money your paying. And if I were a track owner I honestly would not want you to honor me with your presence because the way I see it your an a*****e again just my opinion.
BriarcliffMx
PR Founding Father
Clear as mud!
hershey
PR Elite
Huh....wow surprised that one got past the filter, fixed.
It has nothing to do with the weather, but it is whether or not I get what I am paying for. People are making it about spending x amount of money as though it is too much. I will spend 2x if Im getting the value. Very big difference.
Good thing your not a track owner. I would grace your facility and you wouldnt have a clue who I was or if Im what you think I am! The point of the post was to shed light on ways to grow the sport yet somehow it turns into a BC bitch session, like so many others. My fault only for starting a thread.
hershey
PR Elite
John250
PR Founding Father
Dave, if it makes you feel better, I totally understand what your talking about. I am just happy that only one of my twins ended up racing motorcycles.
I agree, if a kid is on a little 50 track charge $10. Track owner has little to nothing involved with the 50 track. It encourages that family to come out and give it a try. That same family of 5 show back up a month later........pay to get through the gate, buy a $25 OMA card, and pay $25 to try a race. To those that didnt understand Daves post........this is GROWING your business, and revenue . By offering someone a $10 ride on a little PW track.
I disagree with the comments about cost. Yeah, we have to buy motorcycles, and they are expensive. But if your racing on a local level, sometimes its no more than the ball sports.
I have a daughter into competition cheer and hip hop. $250 a month in gym fees. Tumbling classes, uniforms. Trips to virginia beach, Indy, Nashville, Orlando....to cheer for literally minutes on a stage. The cost a huge.
Competitive baseball, soccer.......all have big expenses with them. Unless your playing in a rec league, the cost are big in sports.
I agree, if a kid is on a little 50 track charge $10. Track owner has little to nothing involved with the 50 track. It encourages that family to come out and give it a try. That same family of 5 show back up a month later........pay to get through the gate, buy a $25 OMA card, and pay $25 to try a race. To those that didnt understand Daves post........this is GROWING your business, and revenue . By offering someone a $10 ride on a little PW track.
I disagree with the comments about cost. Yeah, we have to buy motorcycles, and they are expensive. But if your racing on a local level, sometimes its no more than the ball sports.
I have a daughter into competition cheer and hip hop. $250 a month in gym fees. Tumbling classes, uniforms. Trips to virginia beach, Indy, Nashville, Orlando....to cheer for literally minutes on a stage. The cost a huge.
Competitive baseball, soccer.......all have big expenses with them. Unless your playing in a rec league, the cost are big in sports.
ck1racerx
PR Addict
This has turned into one of my fav threads of all time. I can just picture Dave setting at his computer deep in thought of how to help grow the sport. Typing in his thoughts and hitting "Post". Walks away to get a cup of coffee, comes back and reads the responses only to mutter a few choice words under his breath... He then tries to explain it again and gets the same response again.. I would bet money he has verbally cussed out J.O and Bob at least 5 times at the computer screen.
Classic.
Really, I did not see it until I became a 50 parent but nothing, AND I MEAN NOTHING, is done to bring in more kids or to cater to that crowd. 99% of all race tracks are built with big bikes in mind. "Yeah, we have a 50 track over in the corner" is the best you get. You get over to it and its overgrown with weeds, hard as concrete and has never seen a drop of water that did not fall from the sky. If you can choke back the dust, the kids get the pleasure of riding a 50 yard "track" that was ether part of the old track that the big bikes did not like or it was made for remote control cars and just became the 50 track.
Chilitown gave free entry to 50 open in one race last year. What happened? they had 42 show up and a very high number of those came back to the first race this year. 50+ was free at the last race and 5 showed up. Wonder how many will be at the next race when they have to pay? lol
Classic.
Really, I did not see it until I became a 50 parent but nothing, AND I MEAN NOTHING, is done to bring in more kids or to cater to that crowd. 99% of all race tracks are built with big bikes in mind. "Yeah, we have a 50 track over in the corner" is the best you get. You get over to it and its overgrown with weeds, hard as concrete and has never seen a drop of water that did not fall from the sky. If you can choke back the dust, the kids get the pleasure of riding a 50 yard "track" that was ether part of the old track that the big bikes did not like or it was made for remote control cars and just became the 50 track.
Chilitown gave free entry to 50 open in one race last year. What happened? they had 42 show up and a very high number of those came back to the first race this year. 50+ was free at the last race and 5 showed up. Wonder how many will be at the next race when they have to pay? lol
TwentyThreeMX
PR Founding Father
any post that someone else besides me tells dave he's an a-hole, i approve of! DHDS trying to win that pot stir awawrd for 2015. its only may buddy settle down!!!!
JB19
PR Member
I think a good step is giving 50 riders real time on a good track like what JO has said is a possibility. I'll admit that 25$ on the kids track is a bit steep, but I'm lucky enough to have options on where I can take my kids.
Once a kid starts racing, even on a PW50, they should be able to handle a big track. When I raced a PW50 there were no kid tracks. You raced the national track at Kenworthys, Honda Hills, COCR....where ever. Probably part of the reason Ohio dominated the 50 class back then. Racing the big track at places like Briarcliff and Malvern is what kids need.
One thing that is funny is that people will complain about 15$, but not think about all the money they blow. I talked to Glen at Sparks rc track about raising his price from 10-15$. He said he tried and people got mad. .....but they were probably the same people walking in with 2000$ worth of rc cars. Same people who throw 65$ at tires and 250$ for new electronics, but lose their mind over paying 5$ more for all day access to a prepped and heated indoor rc track.
Once a kid starts racing, even on a PW50, they should be able to handle a big track. When I raced a PW50 there were no kid tracks. You raced the national track at Kenworthys, Honda Hills, COCR....where ever. Probably part of the reason Ohio dominated the 50 class back then. Racing the big track at places like Briarcliff and Malvern is what kids need.
One thing that is funny is that people will complain about 15$, but not think about all the money they blow. I talked to Glen at Sparks rc track about raising his price from 10-15$. He said he tried and people got mad. .....but they were probably the same people walking in with 2000$ worth of rc cars. Same people who throw 65$ at tires and 250$ for new electronics, but lose their mind over paying 5$ more for all day access to a prepped and heated indoor rc track.
BriarcliffMx
PR Founding Father
I feel for Glenn, I ran the trucks some there this winter, he is a good dude and works his butt off. Honestly, I would pay him $10 more, at least I can see the improvements and can see that he puts his heart into it.
I'm just pissing with ya Dave (ANDHDS01), remember your own words: Don't take anything on PR too seriously, right? But from now on I'm charging a Fee for 50 parents to spectate on practice days so I can make up for lost time arguing on the internet! THIS IS A JOKE PEOPLE. LAUGH. BREATHE.
John250
PR Founding Father
loneranger171
PR Addict
LMFAO that sh*% is hilarious Knox! Thank you for the laugh... I just pictured the scene and busted out loud lol
KingRacing
PR Addict
Hershey is right. Anyone trying to make money in this sport...track owners, graphics people (I've always told Jimmy the 50 parents are the ones buying graphics... Only ones that can afford it. A few years in this sport and there's not much money to go around) Jeremy, you are very wrong if you are not accommodating the 50s and especially the pdubs! I remember two gates of pdubs
KingRacing
PR Addict
.... Two gates of pdubs at Honda hills Friday night series. Make time in the program. These guys are the future.